Continuations - Latest Comments in A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Vladimir Vukicevic — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 18:05:38 -0000

I'm not sure that your logic aligns with what the scientists are claiming. They believe that any attempt that would isolate the Higgs boson is stopped. So this doesn't have to be our only attempt.

A similar attempt was made in the early 1990s in the US that also failed. It seems that the future intervenes whenever we build something that would put us in jeopardy.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

David Semeria — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 17:59:14 -0000

The problem with the argument is that the LHC must be guaranteed to isolate the Higgs boson, and that it will be mankind's only attempt.

That's a pretty big assumption. Only in this case would the future be justified in intervening.

I can't really believe I just wrote that - I think we've arrived at the requisite level of craziness to consider all of this plausible!

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 16:14:39 -0000

Agree completely.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

LukeG — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:53:35 -0000

So wild. I'm with you that the LHC is a sucker's bet, too, though a fascinating one. I'd place a utility value of the end of the world at somewhere approaching negative infinity; in that case, no matter how small the odds of the LHC causing the destruction of earth and life as we know it, the expected value of the experiment is still...abysmal.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:50:30 -0000

Good point -- I left off the best part. Although in this particular case it might just be crazy enough!

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 14:03:51 -0000

Great article - thanks for the link (and the links from there).

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Vladimir Vukicevic — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 13:55:54 -0000

Agreed...it's a win-win for the world no matter what. Let's hope the future is strong enough to protect us.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 13:49:31 -0000

A risk that I would happily be willing to take!

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Dan McKinley — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:49:06 -0000

See here: http://blogs.discovermagazi...

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

David Semeria — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:46:45 -0000

Well spotted! Let's hope the future is subtle, but not malicious...

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Vladimir Vukicevic — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:39:10 -0000

...unless the "future" is just screwing with us and/or doesn't want us to ever be sure of its role in our present. If that were the case then the 1,000,000,000,000,000 to 1 card test would indeed go with the odds - i.e. the LHC would be allowed to go on. Only after would the "future" step in with a less obvious sabotage and stop it from going live but still leave doubt - e.g. what happened with the magnets.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:12:24 -0000

Yes - that would be the way to do it!

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

Vladimir Vukicevic — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 12:07:05 -0000

In theory - the odds could be tremendously stacked in favor of keeping the LHC - 1,000,000,000,000,000 to 1 that it won't be destroyed. It shouldn't matter how low the odds are since if it's meant to be destroyed then it will be destroyed. This was governments' could argue that there is a greater chance of a natural disaster destroying it than the actual experiment.

...and I agree, it must be 100% guaranteed that the LHC would be scrapped.

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 11:48:59 -0000

I completely agree that it sounds far fetched, but so does much of science -- black holes anyone?

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

theschnaz — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 11:36:12 -0000

I've been following the Large Hadron Collider and heard about this story. This theory sounds pretty far fetched.

Have you seen these science videos? They're great for more info about string theory, planets, etc.

elegant universe (http://video.google.com/vid...

The Universe (http://www.hulu.com/the-uni...

Greg

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

albert — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 11:32:48 -0000

Then again the LHC itself is not an easy thing to explain to tax payers :-) Arguably this could save a lot of money going forward (never mind the universe).

Re: A Mind Bender Worth Testing

David Semeria — Thu, 15 Oct 2009 11:26:48 -0000

Great post Albert!

For the stop card experiment to be valid, it must be 100% guaranteed that the LHC would be scrapped if the stop card came up. Not an easy thing to explain to tax payers...